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Post by doc on Apr 7, 2009 11:47:40 GMT -5
I just figured a work around for the nitrogen that the machine you posted. small 20oz bottle wouldn't last long. Got an old 30 lb. R-12 or 134 laying around? Use a conversion kit so you can make an air tank, then take it to your local welding gas supplier. A 30 lb. fill-up with Nitrogen is about $10. 30lbs would do a bunch of cars. Also, I'll bet you could use it with the redline one, also. One question, Dave. To create smoke from the baby oil, would you need oxygen to make it combust??
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Post by locodave on Apr 8, 2009 0:41:12 GMT -5
Hi, Simple plumbing input-output, control into the can on how it's routed. Air gun tip out of the can to control the smoke. How about this? -> www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=98426 Input air into the reg. With shut off's on a T fitting for inputs. Diffrent input on each T's end. One side for shop air line fitting & other side with a shut off to a fitting that would go to the Nitrogen tank. Using one side, make shure the other valve is shut. Shut the one you have connected to stop air or Nitrogen flow into the tank. You stop building air pressure inside the can. Air input controlled by the reg supplys air or nitrogen into the can to make the oil smoke. Output side on the reg, into the can for the oil. You could prob use a standard air fitting on the hand held. Put it in a vice. Use a small piece of copper pipe, put it into the open port of the fitting. Now you can braze that to the fitting. Do 2 of them. One will go into the top of the can. Drill a hole in the top of the can. Braze or tap threads for the fitting to install it on the top of the can. So you can use some small managable 3/8 or smaller o/d hose. Can to blow tip. Only thing I can think of on a wrinkle. Heat from the can, melting the 3/8 hose. Insulator block made out of ceramic? Or a hose that can put up with 150 deg heat. And on heat build up to the reg from the tank side to the reg. Spiral bendable copper, reg to tank might work. Wrap it around a 2 inch pipe to get the spiral. On the air supply to the tank, your putting in O2 from the air supply into the tank to pressurize it. Don't know if Nitrogen is like O2 on providing "Air' for combustion. And how O2 & Nitrogen would work if you cracked the shop air to do a dual feed. Don't want a poisionus gas if combined. I have a book on welding on what gasses to use with diffrent wires. Steel, stainless. Using a Mig or Tig. To let Toolman know something. I'm a H/S drop out too. Never made it thru my Junior year before I dropped out. Toolman, don't ever sell yourself short. One un-edjewmicated person to another. Lol. Dave
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Post by locodave on Apr 8, 2009 1:01:42 GMT -5
Hi, If you wanted to go the glow plug rout on using 12V. You would have to get a temp sensor for 150 deg. Remember & I know you do. Cars years ago, had a idiot light on the dash that lit up on a cold engine. That was by a temp sensor, contacs closed till it warmed up. Think it was on a Ford. You would have to in-corporate a 12v relay. You would have to wire up the feed side to the relay, thru the temp sensor and electro-magnet. normal position then is energized. To the glow plug power feed to it. Tie into the power feed pos to the relays electro-magnet to the other side to the neg ground side. When the temp sensor got to 150 deg, and opened the circut, it would break the circut & de-energize the relay. Breaking the power source to the glow plug. Are we having fun yet? Dave
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Post by ohioautotech on Apr 8, 2009 18:18:01 GMT -5
Be careful guys.
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riclash
Junior Member
Been there. Turned around and went home.
Posts: 63
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Post by riclash on Apr 8, 2009 22:59:07 GMT -5
Hearing you guys get daring and somewhat-philosphical is quite refreshing. I agree Ohio. Be vigilant about safety oriented applications. Remember that there are always people out there (like myself) perusing the unknown and allow thier adventurous side to ignore common sense. Now, as I have often tried to imply my most sincere respect and honest admiration for your technical expertise, I hope that you guys understand that I feel kind of like the "shade tree advocate". I thourgholy enjoy sitting back and reading all of your thoughtful and informative discussions. So please take in mind that when I say something like "wouldn't dry ice serve the same purpose with a little air pressure" be taken as not a retort, but just an observation that might be relevant.
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Post by locodave on Apr 8, 2009 23:59:29 GMT -5
Hi, Just playing with ideas. I could also get a smoke machine from -> www.123dj.com/l_fogmachines.html?gclid=CN2zkoWA45kCFQzxDAodg22MRw EF40 has a small metal front where the smoke comes out. I could make an adapter for a small hose to the air blow tip with a reg maybe. 25 bucks for smoke haze juice-> www.123dj.com/l_fogjuice.html I would mount the other deep fryer thing on a board so it wouldn't tip. For myself, about the time I bought a deep fryer, regs, did all the work. I'd have about a hundred bucks in it. For the few times I'd use it. That inital addy might be an option. Less B/S. Dave P.S. I work out of downtown Chicago 6 days a week & I could just go into the store and ask any Q's for my use. It's at 2201 S. Union, Chicago. 10-15 min drive. I'm working at 17 N Clinton. 69.99, buy one get another free.
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Post by toolman on Apr 9, 2009 3:55:18 GMT -5
;D Goodmorning and yes we sell fog machines at work and the juice too, not granny kind hehehehehehe Toolman.
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Post by doc on Apr 9, 2009 8:04:08 GMT -5
We have one of those type fog machines and they will really put out a large volume of thick smoke. I have been so busy I couldn't report back, but I called the 800 number of that smoke machine link you gave, Dave. I spoke with him about 20 minutes and he made a believer out of me. One of the drawbacks (that no one tells you) the baby oil has a funkysmell that is hard to get out of the car. And it lingers. Also, the unit has a standard plug-in 1/4" NPT for the Nitrogen add on. I figure I'll get a 30 lb tank and get refills from my welding supplier for about $7.00. His price for the unit was $1070.00 and included free shipping. The liquid smoke is about $70.00 per refill, which is not cheap but I can live with it. All in all, that unit is much better than the one I came up with. Thanks, Dave!
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Post by locodave on Apr 9, 2009 10:36:04 GMT -5
Hi, I'd guess if you wanted to see if the claim on baby oil stinks. Take any old can. "Soup-veggie" Peal the paper off the side. Put some baby oil in it. If ya want to tick off the wife, put it on the stove burner & flame on. See if it stinks up the kitchen & for how long till the smell goes away and the wife isn't mad at you anymore. LMAO. Joking. Just do the same on your outside grill with the lid up? I have a single burner camping stove I might try doing this on. If it stinks like they say it does. Then all that powerfull thinking went out the window eh? Lol. Glad that sight helped you. Other than the cost of the liquid smoke. ( I see it has a ultra-violet dye in it. ) Do they carry the type with out the dye & less expencive? I think you can buy a 110V small tube type black lite. Inexpencively. Good idea on the other tank. Need a reg on the tank to use it also? Just thinking about output pressure on the larger tank. Hooked up to the unit. Common reg like they use on air compressor tanks maybe? Dave
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Post by doc on Apr 9, 2009 12:22:06 GMT -5
He said they regulate their to 75 ibs. Thought that that was high, but I have all kinds of regulators here. No problem.
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Post by locodave on Apr 10, 2009 0:53:14 GMT -5
Hi, For ppl reading this post. I thought I would add a few things. 1st off. Any sealed tank has to have a pressure relief valve. No one wants a tank building up pressure & if for what ever reason it can't be vented. Heat is not at 150 deg anymore & higher heat builds more pressure. Pressure relief valve gets plugged up from use. The hose going to the hand held nozzle didn't ither burst or come off the end it was pushed on because you used a clamp. 2nd dairy vent if the primary pressure relieve valve didn't work. The pressure builds up & can't vent. You now have a hot oil, metal fatigue from the stress. Ka-bloey! Can you say pipe bomb? Home made stuff is ok, you just have to use precautions and if able to. A backup if one part fails. Dave
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